Rhonda Gruber
December 21, 2007 – 7:14 amOh for Pete’s sake, turn on the news, start a rant. That seems to be my relationship with the television these days. But to make matters worse, I am stupid enough to google what I hear on the news. Right now I am having flash backs of my involvement with Damien Echols and the triple murder of three young boys back in 1993. Why the flashback? Because once again the public receives an absolutely distorted view from not only the prosecution (da man) but from the people (da people). In the case of the three people convicted of the 1993 murders, I came to the conclusion that the people standing up for the convicted men tended to be just as loony tunes as the people who prosecuted them. Yes, I believe the men deserve a new trial. Yes, I believe the people who continue to stand up for them helped to provide this new trial (justice thanks you btw) but the tactics used were maddening and I suspect highly profitable. But enough of that matter. I am sure it will resurface soon. Onto more current insanity.
“Rhonda Gruber… has been arrested.. on the warrant it said “practicing witch” I need every pagan you know and all paths to KNOW what’s going on. “
“My name is Rhonda Gruber AKA Wicked Lil Witch and I am a Proud Witch. I am currently being persecuted as a Witch by a Lt. Kevin Duke of the Horry County Police Dept.”
On the arrest warrant it said she was being arrested for “practicing witchcraft? Now now, that is not what it said is it? That is what folk in forums are saying. But what this post at tribe.net seems to say is that 1. She was arrested and 2. The term ‘practicing witch” was used. One would have to actually look at the whole of the warrant to know what it actually says. For all I know, maybe it says she is being arrested because she is being arrested for harassment as a result of threatening to case a spell and announcing that she is a “practicing witch”.
Now don’t think that such is ridiculous. If I am a professional boxer and I threaten to break your nose and warn you that I am a professional boxer, well now would that be arresting me for being a professional boxer? Threatening a person, even with a spell, can easily be seen as harassment. Do it to prevent someone from testifying against you and the crime starts to become rather serious. Not that I immediately thought this was the case, but it did come to my mind. Especially since in the above-cited article, she is quoted as saying she was arrested for:
“Child Endangerment/ Neglect and 1st degree Harrassement [SIC]”
Here are a few more links which promote the idea that this is a new Witch Hunt and that we should all be concerned that the Burning Times are right around the corner. One even goes so far as to equate this event to the Salem Witch trials. When you read these articles, remember that both titles suggest it is the government that is responsible for these events. The first states that the government arrested them “for Witchcraft” and the other title suggests the return of State Sponsored trials against accused Witches for the accusation that the were practicing Witchcraft.
Pagan Family Arrested for Witchcraft
New Salem Trials in Columbia South Carolina
Now lets look at some different points of view.
Bewitched – An article by The Free Times
Unlike the other articles which have a clear agenda to attack the government by causing the assumption that we are returning to a time of the Salem Witch Trials, the title of this article is kinda cute. The article itself is a bit more informative.
“Spencer is detained at the S.C. Department of Juvenile Justice in Columbia, awaiting a sentencing trial for pointing and presenting a loaded Chinese SKS semiautomatic rifle at neighbors from his driveway on Sept. 10…”
Note it states that their son is awaiting a “sentencing trial”. I believe that means the young man was convicted. In the earlier articles, you might recall the claim was made that the arresting officer drove into their driveway in an alarmed state and was aggressive. Did you know that the round fired from the SKS is large enough and moves fast enough that most police issue bullet proof vests do very little to stop them?
Now then, do you remember the statements that the young man could not return to the home of his parents because they owned firearms? Well now, if you had just arrested a young man after he pointed a rifle kin to an AK-47 at a neighbor; would you want that man returned to a home filled with guns and ammunition BEFORE the events were sorted out? Now some of you are going to say he is innocent until proven guilty. This is true. However, this is why people who might be dangerous are held before their trial. This is why conditions are placed on people who are released on bail. I do not think it is unreasonable to say that one of the conditions of bail for a young man accused of threatening an unarmed mans life with a loaded assault rifle is that he not be in a home with assault rifles. Actually, in a time and age when we are needfully growing more concerned about people entering our schools with weapons and randomly selecting their targets this seems like the prudent thing to do.
“Meanwhile, some observers in the Pagan community are reluctant to touch the case. Holli Emore, a local resident and board president of the nation’s first Pagan seminary in Vermont, says the Grubers’ case has nothing to do with freedom of religion and that they are simply crying “witch” to justify irresponsible behavior.”
Bravo Holli Emore! While I have no doubt the harassment by the neighbors may have been based on religious differences, the neighbors are not the ones charged with picking up a loaded rifle and pointing it at an unarmed person. But none the less, here is what the complaint from the neighbors reads:
“The complainant is the father of … a white female 14 years. At one time, she was friends and visited socially at Rhonda Gruber at 2525 Stone’s Edge Boulevard. There has been an ongoing civil dispute between the complainant and the suspect. The Complainant recently found out that his daughter … had been offered and accepted alcohol from the suspect … She also states that she has been offered marijuana. The Suspect is alleged to keep marijuana in the house and in a storage area rented to the Suspect’s husband’s first wife … The Suspect is alleged to also have provided alcohol and marijuana to other minor children. It is also alleged that there are cameras in the bedrooms and bathrooms of the suspect as well as around the perimeter of the house. It is believed that there could be Pornography (child) in this residence as the suspect is constantly inviting young teenagers to the Residence and providing alcohol and drugs to these young teenagers. The suspect also claims to be a Witch and provide potions and powders for these young adults. A neighbor who lives at 2512 Stone’s Edge Boulevard, Layla Blair, allegedly can corroborate these versions as her young son has been to the suspect’s residence also. Mrs. Blair is believe to be going to call for a report also. No further info.”
Well now, I suspect this is where the word “witch” comes into play. In connectin with giving potions and powders to young adults. I don’t see much of a problem with that, especially since this is coming from the neighbor and not a court. It could have easily have said the person was a practicing Jew or Catholic and the government has done nothing wrong in taking the complaint.
Rhonda Gruber, having heard a rumor about the above report, fired back with her own complaint.
“The complainant [Rhonda Gruber] said her neighbor [Laura Luisetti], suspect, has been harassing her over the last month in many different ways. The complainant said the suspect has filed several police reports claiming she has been giving drugs and alcohol to minors, that she has child pornography in her home and telling other neighbors that the above crimes have been occurring. The Horry County Police Department has responded to the suspect’s home several times for these types of reports and they have all been unfounded. The Complainant has been advised to see a magistrate in reference to harassment based on these unfounded filed reports. Call history has indicated over six filed reports, none of which resulted in any evidence of criminal activity on the complainant’s part.”
Uh wait a minute. In one of the other links, wasn’t the statement made that police refused to take a complaint?
The arresting officer had this to say in his report:
“Upon my arrival I spoke with the complainant [Hugo and Laura Luisetti] who states while driving his child and her friend home from the bus stop, the victim was sitting in his driveway holding a SK Assault Rifle. When I made contact with the suspect, his mother stated she had this gun and it was on the floor of the garage in plain view. I secured the weapon and placed Subject #1 [Spencer] under arrest for pointing and presenting and transported him to DJJ. The SK Assault Rifle was taken into evidence. Subject #2 [Rhonda Gruber] during this incident was very loud and aggressive. She was told several times to be quiet and she kept on. At that time, she was placed under arrest for Breach of Peace. Subject #2 [Rhonda Gruber] was also charged with child neglect due to the fact she had this weapon out in an area, unsecured and loaded where this minor could get to it. The weapon was found on the floor of the garage unsecured, loaded right next to a table where everyone was sitting … I spoke with witnesses who stated they saw Subject #1 [Spencer] with the weapon sitting in his driveway. Witnesses gave a description of the gun and also gave voluntary statements. At this point, I and several officers went to the Gruber’s house and found the weapon matching their description in the open garage. The weapon was loaded and in an unsecured location.”
Rhonda responds: “Normally, we have it [the gun] put away, but with the death threats and stuff, we just had it on the floor.”
Ye, I always leave my LOADED guns on the garage floor in preparation for defending my home and children. Is this woman completely bonkers?
Lt. Kevin Duke writes in his search warrant:
“During the past 48 hours, I have been involved with an investigation into the abuse of a 16-year-old juvenile who was arrested for pointing and presenting a firearm (assault rifle). The juvenile has been drug tested by the Department of Juvenile Justice. The results determined the juvenile tested positive for methamphetamines in his blood system. The juvenile’s mother, Rhonda Gruber, was arrested within the past 48 hours for Child Neglect and an investigation determined the following information; She has a web site that illustrates she is a practicing ‘Witch’ and that she promotes drug usage and sexual deviance. Her web page also illustrates that she is a proud member and supporter of The Pagan’s Motorcycle Gang, which has a recorded history of illegal drug trades and violence.”
Nancy Leong, a Madison Fellow for Americans United for Separation of Church and State, says the organization is aware of the Grubers’ case, but is not getting involved.
Ye, no kidding. So now we have two rather prominent organizations who defend people from state sponsored religious persecution avoiding this one. Go figure.
“None of the charges that have been brought against them [the Grubers] have anything to do with religious freedom,” says Angela Buchanan, a spokeswoman for the Lady Liberty League, a religious freedom activist organization for Pagans in Wisconsin. “These people weren’t locked up because of their religious practices, they were arrested because they broke the law.”
Woops, make that three!
“Basically, this stemmed from the fact that I was a witch,” Rhonda says.
As evidenced by the first few links I provided, it is clear that Rhonda Gruber has found people to agree. I am not one of those people. In fact, I think people like Rhonda Gruber do nothing but perpetuate a bad reputation for not only pagans but gun owners and MC members. I think the police were wrong when they indicated she was a member of the Pagans Motorcycle Club. I have met a few of these folk and I can’t imagine they would have her.
3 Responses to “Rhonda Gruber”
I am outraged reading all of the bullshit lies.. on the net. From
people that don’t even know her, or what REALLY happened. Take a
minute, step back and ask yourself “Who the hell am I” to take he said
she said as fact? Read the following:
In regards to what people are posting about Spencer testing positive
for Meth..
Lt. Duke told a bold faced lie. One. Duke was not entitled to even see
the test, it was the test of a minor, and he does not have the right
to see such a test.As a cop he has no right to see the results of a
test of a minor. Two, the son tested negative for all illegal drugs,
including marijuana. Three it was also stated that Rhonda herself was
a member of the Pagans Motorcycle Gang, which would help elude to the
fact that she’s a drug dealer, when it turns out that she was only a
local chapter leader of Pagansnightout, a monthly meetup group for the
RELIGION not the MOTORCYCLE GANG. Why was it mentioned in three
different legal reasonings for why they were doing the things they
were doing was because she was a witch? Currently as of now to date,
Horry County has no evidence to substantiate their claims, they are
between a rock and a hard place because they have to prove to
substantiate their charges. Without evidence they tried to retain her
son, because they saw that as their only “Trump” card to getting her.
It boils down to they want her, and have no evidence, but yet arrested
every member of the family. The family has proof of all the claims,
but yet the family receives minimal support from anyone anywhere. If
they were guilty why would they continue to fight this? Wouldn’t they
just disappear instead of continuing to fight? All of the bad press
that the Grubers have been getting is because people blindly go along
with what the search warrant says. When she posted the search warrant
she didnt think others would turn on her, with the search warrant
being ridiculous, that is the whole reason for her posting the search
warrant. The cop LIED! Nothing in that is true EXCEPT that she is a
witch. Those that think she isn’t still fighting, she hired and still
retains her own attorney, her son has his own attorney that is working
pro bono because he believes in his own words “150% in Spencer’s
innocence.” And his case is currently in appeal, because he maintains
his innocence, and he’s had to be moved in with Rhonda’s out of state
family to escape Horry County’s clutches, which was a hard decision
for her to do, but it was the only thing she could do to keep her son
safe, and herself. I’ve been Rhonda’s best friend for many years now,
and I am disgusted with the lack of pagan support on her behalf all
because of what a cop wrote. A Christian cop at that. She is not
“hiding” behind the pentacle, she’s defending her right to her
pentacle. Even despite all of this shit, if and when she ever is
allowed a civil suit, a chunk of the money is going into a fund for
pagans like herself that cannot get any support from anyone or any
organization. We’ll be damned if this happens to yet another pagan. Oh
and by the way.. this who ordeal with Ms. Stacey. Who the hell are you
out in bumble fuck you don’t know Rhonda, you weren’t there for the
case and obviously you have no evidence to back even your claims. The
only thing she has is a document that was illegally obtained. If and
when it will be proven, she’ll be in her own legal battle. I believe
the term is liable. Just in case anyone thinks that this is Rhonda, I
am not Rhonda. I have attempted on many occasions to defend Rhonda,
since the only thing on the internet is this game of “telephone”
nobody would even let me speak the truth to tell them what really
happened. But just like gossip anywhere else, people like to start
shit, and then everyone jumps on the bandwagon. You know.. as a friend
of the family and all of the friends that actually do know Rhonda and
the family, her real friends are STILL HERE, and are still a strong
support system for her. Unlike the rest of you, you don’t know these
people, nor were you there. So how can you be so sure you really
really know.. what happened? You read what the cop says and you
believe the cop? What if this was you? How would you feel if the
situation was reversed and it was you, and you made a cry out for help
to fellow pagans, and find out there is nothing there. People would
rather believe the worst? How can you criticize another human being
based on what someone told you when you have no fact. The truth is the
only one with any facts at all, and documents and proof is Rhonda. I
am one of the few that have stood by her side, and listen to her cry,
and offer her all of the support I can. You people are sick. She has
spent HOURS on the phone with me crying because of the damage this has
done to her, her family, her son, her real friends. This has even
damaged me. Steve’s father has failing health and wonders where his
son is. Steve was CLOSE to family. Try to explain all this he said she
said junk to him. Are you going to tell him that you just jumped to
conclusions, too lazy to find out what’s truth? Or do you want the
majority vote. It seems to me.. from this experience, that this so
called “pagan community” is nothing more than a bunch of destructive
kids, playing dress up. If you wanted to defend your religion, you
would stick with the facts. If you don’t have the facts, stay the hell
out of it.
By MysticalStorms0528 on May 13, 2008
I am really amazed at the amount of energy this Stacy
has invested in Rhonda’s life. Rhonda became an
obsession of hers to the point that she could not
rest????? The funny part is after reading most of her
(Stacy’s) comments, she was unclear where the negative
energy came from!!!!!! Here’s a thought: “From
within.”
As soon as she allowed herself to become offended by
this case, she then allowed herself to be consumed by
this energy that she was unsure of its origin. To my
understanding, this path is “Individual” with like
minded others along the way meaning: do not the Gods
deal/work with us based on “our individuality, ” “our
spirituality” and not the path itself???? To slam
another as giving pagans a bad name when each pagan
has their own interpretation of what it means to be,
is a bit strange. I feel just as confident in myself
and path as I did before reading anything about the
case.
Now, if “our” path is about, and promote “Love and
Blessings” then that “LOVE” displayed in those
messages clearly show the hypocrisy that to me gives
pagans a bad name!!! Entitled to one’s own thoughts
and opinions? Yes!!! Is it not Rhonda’s own
interpretation of being a witch that she’s entitled to
as well as anyone else? There is a wonder as to why
she may feel persecuted?? !!
Others will view our lifestyle and form those based
on how “WE” present and conduct ourselves, no matter
the circumstances. “WE” are still fighting to be
“accepted” in the mainstream as a whole, so turning on
each other in an internet forum will help this
how?????
Hopefully others will not view her comments as being
representative of the Pagan Way, understanding that
when she sent “Love and Blessings to (All),” that she
is including the one that she is voicing her
“opinions” about!!!
By Mike on May 15, 2008
MysticalStorms0528 said: “It seems to me.. from this experience, that this so called “pagan community” is nothing more than a bunch of destructive kids, playing dress up.”
I agree 99%. I would say that the overwhelming majority of people who call themselves pagan are little more than a collective of destructive children playing dress up despite their age.
MysticalStorms0528 said: “Take a minute, step back and ask yourself “Who the hell am I” to take he said
she said as fact?”
Who the hell am I? I am a citizen of the United States of America who is discussing quotes from the news. This seems to upset you. Perhaps we should do away with that pesky First Amendment thing and just believe each and every thing the News has to give us. Maybe put the media in the hands of the government. Oh wait, much of what I commented on came from other blogs. So maybe you believe we should just let the blogs have freedom of speech and not the news. Oh wait, you think this blog shouldn’t comment on it.
Oh I see what you are saying, only people who agree with your point of view should be able to comment.
This is the way freedom of speech works, the way the United States of America works; people say things, people discuss things, and the facts are drawn out. The people observing the things said and things discussed can form an educated opinion. If I had not blogged about this matter, you would not have the opportunity here to respond with your opinions and the readers would have neither yours nor mine to consider.
So while your opinions are more than welcome, the idea that people should not discuss what other have said, quoted by legitimate news sources, on Television, well that is just anti-American as is the idea that folk should not comment on what other folk are commenting on (blogs).
I could say something derogatory against your race and a rebuttal would be more than welcome, but attacking my right to present that derogatory comment, well again that is not American.
On the Pagan Motorcycle Gang – The proper term is Motorcycle Club or MC. Please do not stereotype the Pagans MC as a gang or criminals. While individuals may break the law, the Club as a whole has not been found guilty of criminal activity & even if they were, ya know some folk live by a different code of ethics. Although I do not know the bylaws of the Pagans MC, most clubs have specific rules for dealing with civilians / citizens (people like you) & if they don’t have specific rules they have general guidelines. Basically, we leave civilians / citizens alone unless otherwise required. Sure, there is some rivalry going on and the Pagans MC is right there in the mix, but unless you are a member of a Club they have issues with then chances are they won’t bother you.
The Pagans MC is a tribe, as is most one-percenters / outlaw MCs (non-AMA sanctioned clubs) which adheres to a general set of morals and ethics that defines a culture. To indicate that being a member of that culture automatically makes you a bad person is just plain bigotry.
MysticalStorms0528 said – “I’ve been Rhonda’s best friend for many years now, and I am disgusted with the lack of pagan support on her behalf all because of what a cop wrote. ”
You were not there, but people should believe you over what the police and witnesses said? They should ignore what the Jury found and convicted on?
MysticalStorms0528 said : “We’ll be damned if this happens to yet another pagan. ”
I am glad my tax money will be fighting your efforts, as I am rather glad the police keep pagan youth from waving around deadly assault weapons. Or is that one of the untrue things that the police and witnesses claimed took place?
Seriously, not meaning to put you off or anything but why would anyone believe the claims of someone who simply was not there over several who say they were?
MysticalStorms0528 said: “Unlike the rest of you…”
Hon, this is a blog and you are the first to comment. There is no “rest of you”. Could you be indicating that the majority of pagans tend to think that if a police officer and several witnesses convince a Jury or Judge that something took place, that it is reasonable to believe it took place? That is not the case. As I have pointed out, many are posting the claims that this was religious persecution. I don’t tend to believe that, but I am one person and this is just a blog.
MysticalStorms0528 said: “You people are sick.”
Again with the plural. You people? Who people? I wrote this entry back in December of last year. At the time, there was blog after blog and post after post claiming exactly what you are, that this was a case of a bunch of Christians attacking someone for being pagan. I looked at the thing in a bit more detail and found information which led me to believe the son had been convicted, that there was police statements, that there were witnesses, and that a Judge or Jury had decided the son was guilty of waving an assault rifle around threatening unarmed people. I concluded that it was rather odd that people jumped to her defense.
Now, a few months later you seem to think the majority of the pagan community won’t support the woman. Trust me on this one, I am not the reason the pagan community turned. I am the blacksheep of the pagan community. Very few listen to me. Hell, I voted for George Bush. Find another pagan who will admit to that and I got someone to drink beer with. Right now, all the beer is mine.
So if you think the pagan community turned on her, I think it is because they saw the results of the courts decision, the witness statements, the police reports, the news coverage, and so on. If you object to the conclusions they came to, well you object to them having the right to make such a decision now don’t you? They can pick and choose who they support and who they do not on their own.
An interesting side note; by far most Pagans I have met support Gavin and Yvonne Frost who wrote what I find to be a pedophilic instructional. But evidently they do not support Rhonda Gruber. Maybe you shouldn’t want their support.
Now if for some odd reason you want support from a published author within the pagan community who strongly opposes the Frosts to the point of alienating himself from the majority of pagan folk, tell the woman to write to ajdrew (at) pagannation.com If she can convince me, I can convince others but convincing me would be one hell of a trick from what I read in the newspapers. She would have one thing going for her, I am a firearms enthusiast who has no problem with using guns to defend my kith or kin. I also have no problem arming children if it is necessary. Better armed than raped or dead.
MysticalStorms0528 said: “If you don’t have the facts, stay the hell out of it.”
Again, you would have people not comment on the news? Not a very American thing to say.
Mike (same IP address as MysticalStorm0528) said: “I am really amazed at the amount of energy this Stacy
has invested in Rhonda’s life. Rhonda became an obsession of hers to the point that she could not rest?”
I do not see the name Stacy any where else on this page. Are you trying to imply that MysticalStorms0528 is Stacy? If so, wouldn’t you know? After all, you two are using the same IP address.
You two are very entertaining.
By A.J. Drew on May 16, 2008